It’s Time To Break Up The Bad Romance Between Conservatives And Israel

We’re watching a typical fake truce in action in the Middle East right now. New rockets are on the way for Hamas and new Israeli settlements are being built further and further east. It’s only a matter of time before the next bloodletting begins. All of this has led me to question why exactly it’s considered to be “conservative” to support Israel. Let’s acknowledge the fact that the Israelis are underdogs (they’re outnumbered in the Middle East anyway) and they’re pretty badass in their way. It’s certainly natural to respect them, but why in the world do we support them in such a knee-jerk fashion?

Bear with me here. This is an overdue conversation among American conservatives.

What are conservatives getting out of this relationship, specifically; and what is the US getting in general out of our special relationship with Israel? I notice that American conservatives always support Israel to the hilt and talk about what irredeemable monsters the Palestinians are, but it never seems to make a major difference in the Jewish vote. Why exactly do we care more about keeping Israel Jewish than….Jewish people do? Every time there’s an election in this country, American Jews overwhelmingly vote for the Democrat (who is generally less inclined to care about Israel than the Republican candidate). They don’t give a shit. Why do we persist?

As for the US’s interests, the unquestionable support that the US has for Israel is doing nothing much but pitting us against the Arab world (and increasingly, the Turks) for the sake of very little. Is this a good decision to make toward the national interest? Pissing off 400 million+ plus people who control a shitload of oil for the benefit of 6 million people who provide us with no vital resources or anything else, really? Is it about supporting democracy? Because democracy is essentially bullshit, you know. I’ve never understood why promoting and defending democracy overseas is such a priority for some conservatives. Democracy has made a royal fucking wreck out of the US, after all.

Are we worried about a human rights disaster if Israel is wiped out? That’s a nice moral concern, but the US does a fine job of ignoring such things in countries where the people don’t look like us. Why is any of this our job, anyway? The Palestinians aren’t our enemies or even our problem. Even Hamas isn’t a particular threat to the US. This instinctive desire to root for Israel and curse the Palestinians makes less and less sense to me with every rocket fired and bomb dropped.

Now I’m not going all anti-Zionist here. Israel has every right to exist as a Jewish state. What I can’t wrap my head around is why we think it’s our job to defend them and demand their protection regardless of what (sometimes brutal) steps they take to maintain that status. That Israeli lobbying cash that keeps our elected representatives in thrall isn’t lining any of my pockets. How about you? I think our “leaders” are duping us, truthfully.

Simply put, I’m tired of defending Israel when the rewards are clearly diminishing, if there are any at all. Demographics and political developments among Israel’s neighbors give me a bad feeling that we’re supporting the losing side for no good reason. It’s perfectly appropriate for us to admire a romantic and embattled people. It’s another thing entirely–and arguably not conservative–to place the ambitions of such a nation above the long-term interests of the United States. I think it’s time for American conservatives to break up this bad romance.

Cross-posted at Right Thinking from the Left Coast

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  • http://twitter.com/TopTheNews Top The News

    Good post. The Founding Fathers non-interventionist strategy was thrown out the window for WWI and has rapidly spiraled out of control. I’m glad you said Israel has a right to exist, as most of us agree with. We don’t have the right to become entangled in alliances for war, as we are currently with Israel.

    • http://anexconsview.wordpress.com/ Paul H. Lemmen

      Our founders would be spitting mad if they saw our current involvement in foreign affairs, the untold billions of hard-earned dollars sent outside our borders to fund our own enemies. Withdraw all of our military and “social aid” people back within our borders, turn off the flood of US dollars leaving our nation and only have diplomatic missions (with accompanying Marines) as our national representatives outside our borders. Screw everyone else, concentrate on our nation and her people, let the rest of the world fend for itself. Let dictators and tyrants rise and fall as they will without our involvement or the shedding of one drop of American blood, our greatest national treasure.

  • newjack31622

    Its not natural at all to support Israel, with their 300 illegal nukes, their rampant humans rights violations, their constant land theft and their bilking of over 3 billion a year from US tax payers. Israel is not an “ally” at all. They spy on us and cause us nothing but trouble. Again-with our own money.

    • http://twitter.com/BradleySRees Bradley S. Rees

      And if conservatives don’t believe that last bit, about Israel spying on us, your favorite Fox News even ran that story a few years back.

      Google is your friend (in this case, at least).

      • gadsdengurl

        According to Susan Linadauer they helped perpetrate 911 as well.

        • newjack31622

          Dov Zakheim,Larry Silverstein,ICTS,Urban Moving Systems,Dominic Suter,Jerome Hauer,Frank Lowy etc. etc. etc. Its clear there was a heavy Israeli element to 9/11.

      • newjack31622

        Yes, the biggest spy ring on US soil in history was uncovered right after 9/11 and it was an Israeli spy ring. Fox News reported on it at the time but quickly killed the story and pulled it from their website.

        • http://twitter.com/BradleySRees Bradley S. Rees

          It can still be found. The interwebz is forever. ;)

  • http://twitter.com/BradleySRees Bradley S. Rees

    Welcome aboard, Thrill. If anything, this piece will at least open a much-needed dialogue.

    Look forward to future posts from you, sir.

    • http://twitter.com/Thrill_RTFLC Thrill

      Much appreciated. Always glad to make smart friends!

  • http://www.facebook.com/gwenctruax Gwen Truax

    ugh, not this discussion-again.

    • gadsdengurl

      Yes this discussion, much needed. How many AIPAC lobbyists are controlling our congress? Ever see McCain cavorting with Lieberman? Sickening that we send this money to a capitalist country that doesn’t need it.

  • http://twitter.com/mark_scudder Mark Scudder

    I have never understood this. I spent a lot of time around college-aged kids and our local college is like 75% Jewish. They are unashamedly liberal, so much so that most of them don’t even seem to believe in God but watch out if they find a swastika scrawled on a bathroom stall. I used to have some college-aged friends on Facebook and it seemed like every few days there was a Facebook event, like “Hillel is sponsoring a pizza party!” Meaning, “Let’s have a party! Gentiles not allowed!” So for the younger generations, it seems that Jewry is a social thing, a community thing, more than it is a religion. I’m not going to pretend I understand their faith, but it seems to call it a “faith” is growing less and less accurate. “Pizza party, Jews only” is existentialist. You’re celebrating who you are, not working in service to God. I guess that explains why they vote leftist.

    Speaking of voting, I don’t think we should do something or not do something because it might get the vote of this group or that group. All this talk about how we need to change the GOP to appeal to Hispanics makes me sick. What makes me even sicker, though, is that all of us will be called anti-Semites for having this discussion, but when Israel is booed at the DNC, they vote for the Democrat anyway. It probably has a little to do with the stereotype leftists maintain that conservatives are fascist/Nazis. I don’t know.

    I’m not very smart when it comes to foreign affairs, so I really don’t know who should have what land in the Middle East, or anywhere else for that matter. I’m just stupefied that your average American Jew thinks being a conservative is anti-Semitic, but half of the country saying “screw Israel” isn’t. I also notice that a lot of people on our side are not only pro-Israel, but reflexively so, defensively so. How much of that, I wonder, is genuine, and how much of it is in fear we’ll be labeled as anti-Semites? It doesn’t make any sense. If the victim mentality that leads to labeling everyone with a dissenting opinion (and “anti-Semite” can be a very powerful scarlet letter), then how come Democrats in general aren’t regarded as such? And if there’s a selfishness aspect to it, why aren’t Jews supporting the conservative ideology, which bends over backwards for Israel every time, right or wrong? It just doesn’t make any damned sense.

    • gadsdengurl

      Don’t confuse anti-semitism with anti-zionism… they are not the same. Zionists are not interested in religioin, only killing in the name of the new world order. Right now Zionists are teaming up with Al Qaeda and our CIA to bring down Assad. What business do we have doing this?

  • kimvy

    Just to get it over with I’ll state that I support Israel and if that makes me a neocon or the other terms bandied about, then so be it. I haven’t seen a compelling argument (to me) yet on to stop that support yet so onwards I will continue.

    But to your point about American Jews seeming disinterest regarding Israel, that’s the liberal way. Bradley had a post the other day about tribalism and keeping people in line and above anything else American Jews are liberals and fall in line to liberal rhetoric. Liberals are a self absorbed bunch and why worry about someone else when it isn’t fashionable to do so. They are liberals first. They bow to that God.

    You also mention diminishing returns. Should that be the only (or one of the more important) reasons for continuing something? What’s in it for me? That almost sounds… liberal… Sometimes things should be done solely for the purpose that it is the right thing to do. Not saying that this is the case here, but even if it were it’s not a bad reason. Principles as it were. It may not be yours, but they are someone’s.

    And why not the Americans. Maybe God feels Americans are best up for the job. Who can argue with that logic? :)

    Interesting topic and thoughts. Thanks for the post.

    • newjack31622

      How about crushing a US citizen to dath? Or killing US sailors? Or bilking US tax payers out of over 3 billion a year and stealing land and killing innocents with it? Not good enough reasons? “Our” media sure has done a job on you.

      • kimvy

        And your media (whatever that may be) on you. You have cites for those points? If I were looking for angels in this issue I’d be hard pressed to find one. I’d love to read more about these points you make, however.

        • newjack31622

          Cites? You know basic history? We give over 3 billion a year. The land is clearly stolen. Or do you say “won” like most shills? And killing innocents? How do you think they get that land? And you saw what they just did to Gaza right? The old “both sides” argument is a false one. There would be no rockets “lobbed into Israel” if Israel were not systematically stealing and killing with impunity and with the protection of nukes that JFK didn’t want them to have and money they should not be getting from US tax payers. Wanna read more about the points I make? Turn off your tv and crack a few books. Start with “The Israel Lobby” by Walt and Mearsheimer.

          • kimvy

            Good grief. L8rs dude. Off to watch cartoons on the teevee. O_o

        • newjack31622

          Oh and almost forgot, the USS Liberty? Ever hear of it? Rachel Corrie? No? Again, the media did a good job(or rather bad job) on you.

  • http://twitter.com/TheBluto Darth Bluto

    The Palestinians are our enemies (see their celebrations on 9/12/01) and their “culture” has made them irredeemable monsters (see “Farfel”). Fuck them all.

    • gadsdengurl

      The Israelis were celebrating too… all that insurance money and all.

      • http://twitter.com/TheBluto Darth Bluto

        they can go fuck themselves too until i get a believable explanation for the uss liberty. but don’t try to blow smoke up my ass about the poor innocent palestinians.

    • newjack31622

      LOL! You have your facts exactly backwards. Israelis, in fact actual Mossad agents, were arrested in NYC ON 9/11(the police report is public record. Do your homework please) itself and they were seen flicking their lighters,slapping hands and celebrating the attacks. The video you speak of(of Palestinians celebrating) was a blatant lie and even some networks admitted the video in question was from WAY BEFORE 9/11 and was totally unrelated. You are severly misinformed.

      • http://twitter.com/TheBluto Darth Bluto

        keep sucking up to the muslims and spreading their amateur propaganda. maybe they’ll behead you last shit-for-brains. when i want the mongoloid perspective i’ll look you up.

        • newjack31622

          Fear mongered to stupidity huh you little neocon lackey? Its very common. The muslims you fear so much are not a threat, no matter how much the media tells you they are. Turn off your tv you gullible fucking moron.

          • http://twitter.com/TheBluto Darth Bluto

            hahaha…i’ve watched beheading videos you simpleton. slow ones where the jihadis are giving kids hands on training in the best methods for cutting threw the meat and sinew and spine. you won’t see these on tv or youtube. you don’t know who you’re talking to, son.

          • newjack31622

            Yes, and since you are a half retarded, fear mongered neocon moron, you think the video(allegedly. Were you googling for these videos that dont appear on youtube? What does that say about you neocon little boy?) you saw means all(or even a large fraction of) muslims are crazy and want to behead you. You ignore that most of these people live in third world countries and are dirt poor, thanks in large part to puppet governments that are often propped up by US tax dollars. Christians, when in similar situations, would also have some extremists among the bunch who would commit violent acts. See history for proof son. You are a warmongers model citizen. Scared of mooooozlims!!! like a good little media consuming boy. The old “dehumanize the victims” strategy worked on you way too easily. Stay afraid of who they tell you to be afraid of little boy. I know you will.

          • newjack31622

            “I watched some beheading videos! Them mooozlims is scary!”. Well Glenn Beck for you ya friggin moron! Just a tip though dummy, they hate us because we occupy their countries, fund the Israeli war machine and bomb the shit out of their countries, not because of our freedoms. Since you obviously buy into neocon talking points and fear monger propaganda.

        • newjack31622

          You fell for BLATANT propaganda and the best you can do is come back with some neocon talking point about beheadings? Really dickhead? Grow up and get a clue you dumb shit.

  • gadsdengurl

    Why is it a sin to criticize AIPAC or suggest that WTC 911 was done on behalf of getting us involved in the middle east? What makes Zionists any better than Radical Islamists? These are questions I would like to know. When people use the bible to justify killing, and call themselves conservatives, it amazes me.

  • http://twitter.com/HarpersReality Bazinga

    hmmm left out one ‘tiny’ fact, they are surrounded with those determined to obliterate them. ALL surrounding them will not even say that Israel has the right to exist, much less work on a true peace. Israel is a democracy; Arabs are allowed voting rights. Not 1 country in the region allows an Israeli to vote. They, like we, make bad decisions and do whatever it takes to keep themselves safe. Israel is the pivot point, if ever the USA abandons them, we are performing assisted suicide.

    • newjack31622

      They have over 300 illegal nukes and over 3 billion a year from US tax payers. Any enemies that surround them were created by their own irrational actions. If you need me to lay out those actions for you then you really haven’t been paying attention and likely get most of your info on the middle east from the corporate media and cable news. Israel is an aparthied state that treats arabs as second class citizens by the way. Just because mommy media and daddy government constantly say-“the only democracy in the middle east” and “surrounded by enemies” etc. does not make it true.

    • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.froland Benjamin Isaac Froland

      Actually the article repeatedly mentions that Israel is “outnumbered…400 million to 6 million” that they are “underdogs” and that some support them for fear of a “human rights disaster if Israel is wiped out.” Your view begs the question: Is it our job to support every country that faces being overrun or is Israel a special case?

  • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.froland Benjamin Isaac Froland

    Fascinating that so many either reflexively love or despise (insert Israel or Palestinians here). Makes rational discussion difficult.

    • http://twitter.com/BradleySRees Bradley S. Rees

      Indeed. Knee-jerk defenders on both sides are rather pathetic. The Palestinians in Gaza smuggle rockets in through tunnels, then fire those rockets into Jewish population centers. Israel was established on land confiscated from Palestinians, after a long reign of terror by Avraham Stern and Menachem Begin (Lehi and Irgun).

      Yet Begin won a Nobel Peace Prize, as did Arafat.

      Plenty more wrongdoing on both sides.

      And our tax dollars fund both.

      This is not even respectful of life, much less in keeping with federalism.

  • http://twitter.com/1Marchella Marchella

    I think it’s important to note that the evangelical Christian community has been brainwashed into believing any sort of criticism of Israel is a criticism on Jesus Christ. I have attended many nondenominational churches and the neocons have even taken over the pulpits and confused MANY people. Just like Rabbi Weiss points out, it cannot be farther from the truth. Great article, it’s a discussion that ought to happen within the conservative realm, but as you know people don’t like to be challenged with incorrect core beliefs.

    • http://www.ronlewenberg.com/ Ron Lewenberg

      Nothing says legitimate like an apostate on Iran’s payroll.

  • http://twitter.com/PhillipCMcGuire Phillip McGuire

    I don’t give flying fuck about Israel one way or the other, I care about America and Americans.

  • jasaero

    My own personal concern is more related with where Islamofacism goes if it is successful in taking out Israel?? And what happens if such a thing somewhat coincides with other questionable nations or groups of the world finally taking action against(economically and/or militarily) our nation as the USA declines out of it’s position as the preeminent superpower of the world.

    We were born as a nation that had kicked out one of the more powerful empires of the world out to gain independence. In doing so we were surely a respected nation from the get go that was not to be messed with for the most part to be sure. That is much different than a nation well perched at the top, but declining with all the risers looking to place their own lands in your spot.

    I think the Jeffersonian stance on all of this assumes those before us would not deviate from said stance in a way that paint a huge target on our nation. There is an article on FDR and WWII that alludes to one of the many ways this target has been painted.

    And really one only needs to read the opening of the DoI to understand Jefferson and others who drafted it, did not see what they were upto as an isolated thing for a singular nation and singular people in history. It says essentially it is the duty of all oppressed peoples of the future to do exactly what they were doing in their own lands.

    Everything about islamofascism runs almost directly counter to those very ideas though. Fascinatingly enough it was Muslim Philosopher’s take on Sharia, Ibn Tufail, from whom John Locke probably borrowed these ideas to a degree, before they were then passed on to our founding. It seems silly to think that any of these entities would NOT support Israel in fighting against this fascism running counter to those ideas does it not? I think we are getting caught up in the falsehood this is some mostly territorial fight.

  • http://twitter.com/lesterhalfjr Chris Hadrick

    I like that you make an effort not to bash Israel. It’s very easy to take either side in this. I agree with the general obvious sentiment that we have much more in common culturally with Israel and that their culture is superior to the surrounding ones in most measurable ways. The irony is the Arabs want us out while the Israelis want us to help them constantly. I wish it were the other way around it would make it so much easier.

    Another important factor: the neoconservatives themselves. They are

    1. irritating
    2. far too comfortable with and in Washington DC and
    3. have a weird relationship with the truth. We saw it in the massaged intelligence for Iraq. We’re seeing it again the campaign to stop Hagel from becoming SecDef.

    random note- re Israel/ Palestine I’d recommend the book Jerusalem 1913. http://www.amazon.com/Jerusalem-1913-Origins-Arab-Israeli-Conflict/dp/0143113283/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1358898300&sr=8-1&keywords=jerusalem+1913 best book I have personally read on the topic. gets to the heart of the matter